Mt. Whitney Portal Store & Hostel Forums General Mt. Whitney Portal Store Message Board Sleep Aids

I searched the board, and could only find threads on Diamox.

Has anyone tried anything else to assist in sleeping? Tylenol PM? A flask of Wild Turkey?

I realize that alcohol can have other bad affects, but I included it, just as a talking point.

We got into Lone Pine two days before our hike. Couldn't sleep either one of them. I tried a couple MGD's. Didn't work for me.

BV...(truce?) I have trouble sleeping at altitude, especially in a sleeping bag on a Z-rest, but I'm not real hot on taking a lot of drugs. I take half a tylenol PM about 8:00 p.m. which works well for me... helps me get SOME sleep so that I feel good the next day but I don't wake up with that "groggy" feeling.

BV - get used to it. Rosabella is one of those "Gadflies" that frequents this board and thinks everyone needs to hear her reply..

BV - Truce - what a joke..

She doesn't care of you want to "truce" or not.

And by the way, she doesn't speak for the "WE" that she usually claims to.

Melatonin, 3 mg, when you sack out. May double up to 6 mg (I often do on the first night of a backpacking trip...don't sleep well the first night on a "different" bed, even a real bed, not my Z-rest).

Seems to help...

(available in most pharmacies or health-food stores)

Thanks. One of my partners is thinking of trying Tylenol PM. It sounded good to me, anti-headache, and a bit of sleep aid. I guess I am just a bit paranoid about anything that can make me sleep, especially when my body may be under other stresses like HA.

The Melatonin, I have read about as well.

Hmm. Something to bounce off the team.

BV.

P.S. Rosebella...I don't hold grudges, you said your peace, I said mine. That is enough for me. I had a teacher in college that once said to me, "Nothing is obvious until it is pointed out to you." I try to live by that, both on the giving and receiving end. On the give, I find it helps others greatly, which does nothing but turtle wax my Karma. On the receiving end, I have to be flame retardant, which I am.

I would listen to Rosabella. Not many women hike the whole John Muir Trail by themselves. She certainly has respect in my book.

I never sleep well on the mountain.. Before the hike it is always excitement. During the hike the altitude and noise of the wind blowing make it hard. Also the pad isn't comfortable like a bed at home would be.

Don't take sleeping pills (like the ones with the medicine in Benadryl) They can interupt your natural breathing pattern up at elevation. There is some benifit in Melatonin or a muscle relaxant like Aleve. But truth be spoken, it you sleep well you are lucky. I always wake up many times during the night...like at least once an hour. This contributes to the fatigue you feel.

several things conspire to keep you awake at high altitude (Cheyne-Stokes breating is one of the most common - you literally stop breating and wake up gasping for air, also you are likely consuming your own body since you probably eat less than you burn and you are a touch dehydrated at night). While you can try different drugs to put you into a deeper sleep, I personally would not want to sleep longer when I stop breathing and you will still wake up at some point. Diamox and ginko biloba are two drugs that have been show to help your body adjust to altitude and that helps you to sleep better.

All Tylenol PM is Tylenol laced with Benedryl. If you are taking this just take a Benedryl tab and be prepared for super dry mouth and to be groggy when you wake up.

Bill

Did you ever try Valerian Root Capsules? It is natural and have no side efects. Need to be taken two hours before going into the sack. It is over-the-counter product.
Anyway I am against of any "helpers" in the nature.
Try meditations before sleep.

I always take a pair of earplugs. You never know when you'll need them, noises like wind flapping the tent and nearby tents with snorers contribute to keep you awake too.

They're also nice to have if you're trying to sleep at the trailhead parking lot the night before starting.

last time we did the mtr's route we popped a valium with some tecate around 5:30pm at the portal and were out by 6.30. mixed in a late afternoon jay. slept well until 2.30am. time to hike. better living through chemistry.

Aleve is not a muscle relaxant, but an Non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drug. A prescription version is Naprosyn.

The difficulty in sleeping in altitude is *generally* altitude sickness. Treating the altitude sickness is the way to aleve the problem.

Benadryl is effective in making sleep for many, but the sleep is not natural, and a "drug hangover" is very common in the morning, very unpleasant when you have to be pushing yourself, physically.

Vicodin ES is probably the best all-around mountain drug. During the day it helps with aches and pains. At night, if you up the dose a little, it is an effective sleeping aid. And as a bonus, it has a constipating effect (being an opiate) on most people, so you won't have to use those nasty solar toilets. Being an opiate however, it will depress your respiration, so you want to be careful and monitor that. If you wake up dead it will cast a pall over the mood of your hiking party. Finally, try to stay away from the illegal drugs, because you never really know what's in them.

Spike,

I find it interesting you'd suggest both..
Take Vicodin ES, and
stay away from illegal drugs

Vicodin can be taken legally only with prescription, and I doubt you'll find an MD who will prescribe it for a sleep-ease in the mountains.

And your comment "Vicodin ES is probably the best all round mountain drug" is insane. If you are taking prescribed Vicodin for a medical condition you probably don't have any business being in the mountains. I hope I'm just being sucked into silly sarcasm here.

The most obvious answer to this thread is... deal with your difficulty sleeping without drugs of any kind.

Cheap Wine! A co-worker once told me about this. Since I don't drink except to get to sleep I bought a bottle of burgundy. Tastes like battery acid, but a shot glass of this stuff puts me to sleep in minutes. I tried a one day trip in late August, tookan allergy pill Tavist Nighttime but woke up in 2 hours with my heart pounding so hard I thought it would burst. You know- the anticipation jitters! The Tavist works good but takes an hour to work. Had forgotten to bring a tiny bottle of burgundy. Sure wish I'd had it and I could have gotten back to sleep. As it was I didn't get enough sleep and burned out early.

Not everybody does as well with alcohol as a sleep aid. In fact some people sleep poorly after drinking even moderate amounts. It works for me though.

I'd be careful about other drugs or supplements. Best to test them out in advance.

Other ideas:

- have a really good meal the night before
- consider carrying in a thicker comfy pad
- take the time to bring or make a good pillow
- earplugs
- a tent to block light, wind, and bugs
- your cuddly little Teddy Bear

Finally:

If nothing works, just accept the fact that you're going to feel like crap. Or did you think that mountain climbing was supposed to be fun?

Ear Plugs are a good idea.

After a 4000 foot climb with a backpack, I've never had any trouble falling asleep.

However trust me on the ear plugs. I just spent an overnight on a lake side in Algonquin Park Ontario and those pesky loons can keep anyone awake.

Just a quick follow up...

I brought some melatonin along for the trip. I had 3mg tabs, and doubled each dose when I took it.

I alternated nights, taking on one night but not the other. Unfortunately, I developed a sinus infection while I was up there, so sleep was restless to say the least.

I think the Melatonin worked to relax me a bit. Even though I remember waking up often, when I did, I felt very refreshed, and ready to move on.

I dunno if this is evidence of anything, but I figured it was anecdotal evidence worth sharing.

It is very common at higher altitudes that the first couple of nights are rather sleepless. Once your body starts to aclimatize, sleep sets finally in. Diamox may help, but it has a bunch of side effects that outweigh the benefits. I suggest Diamox only in case of severe AMS just before a descent to be in better shape. Part of mountaineering is sleeping poorly...