Mt. Whitney Portal Store & Hostel Forums General Mt. Whitney Portal Store Message Board stove question

Hey guys (and gals)...

I just bought (and used for the first time this weekend) a new stove system. Vargo Jet-ti . It's a nice little burner that threads into one of those handy little canisters like a snow peak.

I really liked the way it worked this weekend. However, I have a question about the stoves after a training I sat through with from my local Boy Scout Council.

One of the trainers was saying that these kind of stoves are unreliable at altitude or in cold temperatures. I have plans to take this stove up San Jacinto with me in August.. and possibly into the Sierra in July, but do not want to rely on it if there is going to be an issue.

Can one (or more) of you who have experience with these systems share your experiences with me please?

I'd hate to get someplace and not be able to cook my food or warm water for tea or chocolate. That might make me fussy

Thanks!!!

Isobutane (the butane/propane mixture) is what's commonly used in canister stoves these days. Butane goes from gas to liqud at about 32F and it won't come out, but the mix with propane partially solves this problem. If you've been hiking all day and the sun has been on your pack, it should be warm enough to start with no problem. Keep the canister in your tent at night and it should be warm enough in the morning to start during the summer in the Sierra Nevada Mtns., even at altitude

San Jacinto in August - I'd worry more about it being too warm for ME on San J! Its quite warm at night up there! Expect temps in the 50F range in August at the higher camps (Round Valley & Little Round Valley). Was on San G this weekend (11,500ft) and it was about 40F on the summit at dawn (the remaining snow patches hadn't frozen overnight).

Sleep with your canister and you will be fine. Are you heading out during the dead of winter in the Sierra or other mountain ranges where it gets to the single digit in the daytime?

Another party on the Root Canal glacier on the Alaskan Range used the canister stove. The Root Canal glacier is 7K' and temp got down to the teens. I saw two guys yesterday thinking about using canister stove on the West Rib of Denali. Denali goes to 20k' and temps up there can get to below 20 on a regular basis. I asked if they are going to bring those and they said they will test it out on the West Buttress at the 17k' camp before taking it up on the West Rib.

My experience has only been with the MSR white gas stoves. Those work everywhere and everytime.

Honestly... the thought of packing white gas is a bit beyond my comfort zone. Just the thought... I don't know. It was a big step for me to go to the butane one that I just bought.

The most extreme at this point will be some snow camping in the Sierra this upcoming winter... I'm still a newbie to the cold weather type of stuff and have to work myself up to it slowly. As much as I would love to do something totally awesome like Denali.. it is so far beyond my abilities that it's almost pipe-dreamish

They (at the training) said that it wasn't a good idea to sleep with your canister. Have you ever heard about anything happening?




LOL... to warm? I spent this weekend backpacking up by Warner Springs... I think it was about 90 degrees on the ridgeline where we were yesterday. I went through 2 gallons of water...

I own two stoves, my antique Svea 123 and an MSR "Pocket Rocket" canister stove. Given the choice, I'll carry the Svea any time. I've been hauling white gas for the past 30+ years, so no nervousness about that.

The MSR worked just fine as high as 10,800' around Dollar Lake on our way up to Kings Peak (Utah state highpoint). Overnight temps were mild, in the 40s.

My only concern about sleeping with the canister would be if it decides to leak. I've had issues with the larger Coleman canisters that we use in Scouts leaking if you disconnect them after they're down about half. Obviously, you don't want the isobutane leaking in your tent and suffocating you (it's heavier than air so it would stay down on the ground where you are sleeping).

That said, I'll use the MSR whenever I have to fly somewhere. Can't take the Svea or fuel bottles on the airplane either carry-on or in checked luggage, so the MSR goes in my checked luggage and I buy canisters at my destination.

For a winter trip (or one to high enough altitude where the conditions are essentially winter), I'd have to get the Svea there somehow.

I slept with my canister once, then it began to complain that I never called...



I've had less luck with MSR. I've got an old Whisperlite that, despite having been completely cleaned and overhauled, still performs unreliably at altitude. My old Svea, on the other hand, totally rocks. Too bad it's so heavy.

I've used a canister stove for a while. As long as you know the limitations and the work around it will serve you well in all four seasons.

The elevation thing is hogwash. I've never had a problem with gas at elevations 12,300' and below but the cold thing is real.

Sleeping with the canister works but even more effective is put the canister in some warmed water

I use my canister stove in the winter, so I might have some hot chocolate at my mid-hike meal. It's only failed me once, in blizzard conditions. I would never take on a winter backpacking trip, white gas is more efficient.

Totally agree w/ WB about the elevation thing. My Jetboil fired up just fine on the summit of White last year (mmm... pigs in a blanket and cowboy coffee) and my Primus stove was fine this past weekend on the shores of Tulainyo Lake (12.9K). I will be trying the white gas thing in the near future, especially for efficiency when melting snow, etc.

The only issues I've ever had w/ cold is more due to the touch started instead of the gas. Cans usually go in the bottom of my sleeping bag (in winter only).

-L

Steve that is REALLY REALLY funny.Can't believe there was no reaction to the best one-liner in quite a while.

I used a JetBoil using the same fuel system snowcamping between Badger Pass and Glacier Point in January 2007. Nights in the 20's probably. Kept the canister in the sleeping bag but soon learned that I had to keep the stove warm also as the fuel would liquify when hitting the mechanism if the stove was too cold. It was not easy, but it worked. The stove was lots less efficient, but it functioned. Recommend you bring plenty of fuel, especially if you will need to melt snow for your water. I probably would bring my Svea on a future trip, but the cannister worked in a pinch.

I made hot cocco in the Whitney summit hut with my Jet Boil a few times. It was cold enough to want something hot, but not WINTER conditions. Worked perfectly.

I've used a Jetboil for 40+ nights in the summer and fall over the past 2 years - mostly above 9000 feet. Never had a problem. Before the Jetboil, I used a whitegas MSR. Had to clean it out a few times over 5 years, but no serious problems.

Can't beat the Jetboil for ease of operation. Never have to strike a match. Also, solo using mostly Mountain House single servings and being careful about fuel consumption, I go through slightly more than 2 small canisters in 16 days.

I have used my MSR Pocket Rocket for years, and never had any trouble at all. I used it last year at Trail Camp, and boiled water for me and a group of young men whose stove would not light. I don't think you will have any trouble. As you empty the canister, the canister will get extremely cold, but that is normal.

Hey There So Cal Girl,
I have an MSR Whisperlite stove and I'm very happy with it. I've had for 3 years and used it in temps as low as 10 degrees. I do keep the gas as warm as possible and I do keep it in my tent on cold nights--never had a problem (most 3 season tents are well ventilated). Sometimes the cans do leak, but I've found that I can hear a "hiss." (not one of your snakes!!) And, it's only happened once--after I dropped the can on a large rock--I do carry the smaller can as a back up for longer trips.

I enjoy "summit tea" and have used it atop Whitney, Gorgornio and San Jacinto with no problems.

This stove has a simmer on the burner to cook real food instead of freeze dried stuff. I've never used it for snow melting because I haven't done the big time winter stuff.

I agree with MooseTracks about the JetBoil stove. I have one, and have used it atop Whitney. Even at 14,500 feet, it boils my 16 ounces of water in just over a minute. I love the stove, and take it with me on all my overnight hikes. Whitney Mike

I have used both liquid fuel and canister stoves from sea level to 11,600' and everywhere in between without any problems. Canister stoves work just fine at elevation. If you use the isobutane/propane mix, you can use it down to high 20s without too much trouble (but at that temp don't count in cooking for an hour without losing a lot of stove output as the canister cools by decompression). Some canister stoves allow you to invert the canister, making them true four season stoves.

For summer use, I would not hesitate recommending a canister stove for the Sierras.

My jetboil worked fine on White Mountain peak but what did not work AT ALL was my 60 dollar storm proof lighter, the ignition switch on the jetboil burned out the first time I used it.

You would have laughed if you had saw me scraping my knife and forks over the stove and beating other bits of metal I could find up there trying to get a spark with NO luck at all, and to rub it in my face I found a normal 50 cent lighter in the register box (thank you someone ) that lit right up no problem!

If you want some serious cooking in the backcountry... get the MSR Dragonfly International. It has the simmer option. I've also used this stove with a great deal of success at altitude (17k') and extreme cold (-10F) and also with car gasoline in Russia.

bacon and eggs near Seven Gables


steaks at Gayley camp

This thread seems to be popular. So here is a twist on the "stove at high altitude/low temp topic":

If you are at more extreme altitudes and/or low temps, then your choice of LIGHTER to light the stove is important. Of course, some stoves have built in electric sparker things.

On various expeditions higher than Whitney (or elsewhere just plain cold) I have found that matches always work, but cigarette lighters may not. Volatilization of the fuel is the problem, so the cigarette lighter must be kept warm in a pocket near warm flesh, not an outside pocket in a down suit. Or, as I mentioned, just use matches. Harvey

I have had allot of trouble getting my lighter lit at even 11,000 so it's something to think about for sure.