Mt. Whitney Portal Store & Hostel Forums General Mt. Whitney Portal Store Message Board Bear Canister Requirement

Since we're giving anecdotes, here's mine. As a result, I have a healthy respect for bears and their desire to take your food.

This was way back in 1974. My dad and I planned a trip in Tuolumne Meadows, with our first night at Glen Aulin. I was young but quite experienced, and even though we never had problems with bears before, we knew we had to suspend our food. I tossed a line over a branch and pulled our stuff sacks about 15 feet high. The sacks ended up just a couple of feet from the trunk of the tree, but I figured, since the tree had a diameter of only six to eight inches, no bear could climb that slender a tree .....

Around midnight, I heard a rustling noise. I shined a flashlight and saw the dark figure and the reflection of those eyes trying to get up that tree. I got out, yelled, shined the light and banged a pot. The bear ran off, but maybe an hour later, he/she came back .... and completely ignored me, shimmied up the skinny trunk and played pinata with our stuff sacks. I helplessly watched our trip end as he/she sliced open our bags and ate some of the contents.

The next morning, we were tired due to little sleep. We had to leave, but packing was a problem because our sleeping bag stuff sacks were ruined. We ran into a ranger on the trail out, who noticed we were carrying items in our arms. We told him the story, and he asked me, "Well, didn't you throw rocks at the bear?" I gave him an are-you-kidding look, and he told me that's what we should have done to scare them off. I highly doubt that a ranger would encourage rock-throwing nowadays.

Bottom line - I won't argue with anyone who says bear canisters are required.

docdiamond, I've camped at Outpost several times for many days at a time. Everybody's perspective is different, but I felt there was plenty of room from tent to tent, at least compared to Yosemite campgrounds and others. For one thing, I never experienced bears at Outpost, but have experienced them down at Whitney Portal, and I do not think it is likely with all of the cannister usage that anyone will have a problem at Outpost. The biggest problem, I feel, is with the marmots. Just putting your cannister away from your tent should suffice at Outpost, and you can put rocks on it or anchor it someway, but, again, the likelihood for a bear is slim. But, since I am an old Boy Scout, I do believe in being prepared.

By the way, I've had many bear encounters over the years, from the Sierras up into the Cascades. Never any danger that I am aware of, but I have had a bear sniffing around my tent at night along Bubbs Creek above Kings Canyon, as evidenced by the paw prints the next morning. I've also found bear tracks on top of my fresh tracks when I did a turn around on a hike in Sequoia National Forest. I was on a dirt road, and the bear walked right on top of my tracks for about a mile. And I was checking out a little cave in Yosemite when apparently its owner, a bear, came back home. That was interesting. The bear scared me, I scared him, and we both took off in opposite directions, since at that instant I was at the mouth of the cave.

Sorry for the firestorm.

I base what I have posted based on talking with friends and other hikers.

I have seen 3 bears in the Sierra and none in the Traverse Ranges of SoCal in all my years of hiking. Based on conversations I believe I am representative of most hikers/backpackers. Two of my sightings were when I was behind steel and glass in Whitney Portal 1999 and June Lake in 1997. My last encounter was day hiking to Robinson Lake in ~2004. This was the only time I saw a bear doing what a bear was supposed to do...maybe. We were about 1/4 mile from Onion Valley Campground. I've never seen a bear while backpacking.

To the nill comment, once you are above the tree line your chances of seeing a bear, let alone one bothering your food are close to zero. At Trail Camp, where most will spend a night, the problem is marmots. Leave you food out and you will have fed a family of marmots for a year. I've used Ursacks/nylon stuff sacks in this type of area for years, just hanging over a rock above the ground, and have never lost an ounce of food.

Thanks ep, Scott L and all the rest of you for some great practical advice about how to use the canisters and about the marmots. I had forgotten about their affinity for salt, so I really appreciate the advice about keeping anything that I have sweat on out of reach of the Marmots.

I'm headed up July 10-12th for my first time. I hope to run into some of you up there.

Brent N

wb -


I'm laughing so hard I can hardly eat my lunch! I really appreciate your wit and humor here, if I haven't already said so another time!

Brent - Enjoy your first time on the mountain! It is truly a special place, whether or not you make the summit. Let us know how it went.

CaT

Natural Bear protection:

chase

treed

Throw rocks at a bear??? That's crazy!!! Instead, charge the bear! I did that in 1997 on the JMT at the Center Basin junction when throwing rocks on its head didn't work. I chased it about a quarter mile, screaming at the top of my lungs like a banshee, before the bear disappeared. The bear didn't come back that night or the next.

WARNING WARNING WARNING - Don't try this yourself. It could have gone ugly real quick.

I have been throwing rocks for 20 years and it has worked every time. Of course you have to yell a lot and you must have an accurate arm. It helps to get at least two people yelling, and always give the bear an escape route.

What I have found to be completely ineffective is banging pots together. You really need to show some rage (IMHO) - then calm down quickly after the bear leaves. It gets the heart rate moving rather quickly.

Thanks, CaT and Wayne. It is very hard to visualize Outpost Camp, since there are not many pictures available. I just thought that people were allowed to camp anywhere and that there weren't any designated sites. By the way, Wayne, I am in Raleigh, NC. Pleased to meet you.

Thanks for the encouragement, CaT. I can't wait.

Brent N

Well, welcome aboard, docdiamond. That makes at least three of us this side of Mt. Whitney here in North Carolina: you, BeachAV8R and me, and maybe one more somewhere around Charlotte.

Outpost camp is kind of an open area near a meadow...where you can camp anywhere you find a flat area. I search for a few photos

Looking north across camp

http://outdoors.webshots.com/photo/1190486995034339099wYifqU

Looking South from the edge of camp.

http://outdoors.webshots.com/photo/1086379789048552364DratSc

It seems this one is just above camp looking east

http://outdoors.webshots.com/photo/1190460738034339099bUdrvi

Thanks for the pics, Cashkraft. I am amazed at how rough and unprotected Outpost Camp really is. It is so different from what I am used to here in NC! I can hardly wait to see it for myself.

I’ve read on this forum of bears at the Portal, but not at Outpost Camp or Trail Camp. I hope it stays that way.

Throwing rocks at the bear…that was one of the first questions the ranger asked me when I reported my bear encounter last year in Yosemite. I told him that I did but probably missed. I’m not a good shot at hitting a silhouette in the dark. I quickly decided to just let the bear take whatever it wanted to take, and I went back to my tent and waited. I could hear the bear sniffing at my bag; no, it must have been sucking in all the air like a vacuum cleaner because sometimes when it exhaled it sounded almost like a whale when it blows. It wasn’t going away anytime soon, so I started going through my pockets to find what I could use to defend myself should the bear break into my tent. Rummaging through my pockets I found my keys with attached pocket knife in one pocket. Ugh-oh, in the other pocket I found GU packets that I forgot to stuff in my Bear Boxer canister. (They were all clean, sealed packets.) Just to be safe I decided to throw them halfway between my tent and my bear canister, thinking that I could pick them up in the morning. But no sooner than getting back into my sleeping bag, I could hear the bear snorting and moving toward the packets, then slurping and finishing them off. Bears don’t chow down like dogs; instead, they take their time as though enjoying a gourmet meal. It then went to my canister. I could hear it move the rocks I had piled on top of it, but it gave up real quick, maybe after 20 seconds or so. It still wasn’t finished with my backpack though, and it was at it again; I thought that my backpack was being torn to shreds. I started wondering before falling half asleep …do I have enough duct tape to tape my bag up …could I give away my sleeping bag and canister to other hikers on the trail and make just one trip back to the trailhead …how many trips will I really have to make back to the trailhead to get all of my trash out?

When I got up in the morning, it was a total surprise to me that my backpack was pretty much in one piece. The only major tear was on the top cover. It had zeroed in on my vacuum sealed, freeze-dried dinner. (I felt a bit out sorts the day before and had no appetite. I forgot to put my first day’s meal back in the bear canister.) I had left the top cover unlatched. For some reason the bear had unpacked three-quarters of the bag. (It wasn’t until I got back home that I found a zip-loc bag with a couple of GU packets inside that had slipped to the bottom of the backpack.) When rolling up my sleeping bag I found a GU packet in the bottom of my sleeping bag. Does that mean that the average bear doesn’t want to cross the tent barrier and deal with humans?

When I asked the Tuolumne ranger if he was going to give me a ticket, he said that he could give me a $100 ticket for leaving food unattended but decided to let me go this time.

After all that excitement, the one thing I will always remember from my first camping trip in the Sierras (at the tree line below Mount Lyell, next to Heart Lake, 10, 185 ft) were the stars. I couldn’t believe how much the stars sparkled at night.

It is more protected than Trail Camp. However, I went through there about 5 years ago in November and tents were blown all over the place. I imagined, their owners coming back and saying, "Hey dude, where's my tent?". It was a big mess.

Personally, I wouldn't camp in Outpost Camp on a bet. Lone Pine Lake is more sheltered and quieter. Day hikers don't go tromping through the Lone Pine Lake area at 3 AM like they do at Outpost Camp.

Here is a map showing some of my favorite places to camp along the main trail. Lone Pine Lake is not among them, because it is somewhat off the trail, but I agree with wbtravis5152 that it is a fine and secluded place.

And, there is an area south of Outpost Camp proper that is sufficiently away from the trail that you shouldn't be bothered by early dayhikers. But I didn't include it, as well as the primary Trail Camp area, because there are plenty of nicer spots around.

Some of the X's wouldn't be great in a storm, since they are somewhat exposed. But in a storm most places are not nice.

Of course, I have left out the locations of my most favorite spots!

Bob R: Can you give a little more info re: the area "south of Outpost Proper"? Is it east or west of the creek crossing? Where, in relation to the waterfall? We've always wished we could find a little more secluded campsite in the general area of Outpost. Thanks for any more specific info you can pass on. We plan to be @ Outpost July 9.

If you look at the Xs to the right of Bighorn Park, that is a really nice secluded area. As you ascend the trail from Portal, just before you drop down to Bighorn Park and the stream crossing, go upslope to your left. There are a lot of nice areas to set up camp there. If you go up a ways, you get to a relatively flat area with commanding views of the Whitney crest, just below the boulder field.

My highest elevation bear experience was last summer at lake 12,188, the first lake in Williamson bowl as you come from Shepards pass.
We had just come from Whitney where we had climbed the MR. While at the WPS Doug told us about a bear that had just recently come through one of the windows. They had arrived at the store soon after with a dog and the bear skidaddled back out the broken window. Doug showed us where the bear had knocked down a rack, etc. The presence of bear was palpable in the recent aftermath of the incident.
Two nights later we were camped just off the shore of the lake at 12,188'. I was in one of those rock "forts" backed up against a rock pile. From my sleeping bag, lying on my back, I looked straight up at Mt. Tyndal. The fort was low at my feet and to my right, but on the left there was a rock about 2' high.
At around 2:30 AM I was awaked by a low, rumbling growl just on the other side of this rock. I could imagine the bear nosing around as it kind of "purred" in its throat. The bear cannister was in the fort with me, so I was quite nervous that the bear's interest in the food smells would overcome its apprehension at the human smell. My headlight was near my head, so I inched my hand to it. Even though I was half frozen in fear, I felt it would be best if I peered over the rock first - scaring the bejezzus out of the bear rather than vice versa. The throaty growl continued, but did not seem to be coming closer as I summoned my courage. Soon I sat up in an adrelin induced rush, rose to my knees and shined my light into the void beyond the rock. I was startled by the vast nothingness. Rocks and nothing else. I tried to calm my breathing. As I did, the growl came again, emminating not from beyond the rock - but from my stomach. I kid you not!
Doug's bear had journeyed with me (in my head) all the way from the WPS and conjured itself up in the middle of Williamson bowl.

Regarding protecting your food against bears, no one here is advocating guns or spray. Nevertheless, today's AAC newsletter had this link to an interesting study: Bear spray is better than guns.

The researchers analyzed 20 years of data. The last two paragraphs are worth quoting:

"Smith said he believes one of the primary reasons bear spray works is that it gives users a reason to stand their ground. Running is the worst response to an aggressive bear.

"Still, the study contains an important caveat about the use of bear spray. Researchers found 11 incidents where bear spray applied to objects like tents, with the intent to repel bears, backfired and attracted them."

I think that the next time I venture into grizzly territory, it will be with some bear spray...not a canister.