Mt. Whitney Portal Store & Hostel Forums General Mt. Whitney Portal Store Message Board Nutrition, Hydration, and Sports Performance

Yesterday, I went to a continuing education program at my hospital on the above subject. The coordinator had notified me about it, as she thought I'd be interested. I was. She also email the speaker that there would be a doctor present interested in mountaineering, and forwarded an email to me in which the speaker had responded that she looked forward to meeting me, as she was also a hiker.

So I show up a little early, and the introduction was made. We had a very nice conversation, and talked about a number of things related to her topic, as it relates to mountaineering. She mentioned that she was a hiker herself, and although she didn't consider herself a mountaineer, climbed Whitney yearly, and had climbed Kilimanjaro. Well of course, I started talking about this board, she was aware of it, and had done a couple of hikes with this woman.....Moosetracks! WHAT?! You know Laura!!??

It turns out that the speaker was our very own Ellen, who is an occasional participant! One degree of separation.

She gave a most interesting lecture. She is a professional nutritionist, and on the scale of expertise of 1-10, she is an 11. She works for professional sports teams, such as the Lakers, and told some endearing stories about some of the players.

In fact, I was rather astonished when, during the course of her talk, she cited two sources by name: Shaquille O'Neal ....... and me! It was quite touching for her to mention me as an authority on mountaineering medicine in front of my peers.

At any rate, she had some fascinating information relating to performance preservation and enhancement, related to nutrition and hydration issues. When I get a chance, I will upload (with her permission-she gave me the CD with her presentation), some of the slides to the board. There were some specific things that I think will be quite provocative.

But for me, a very fun and entertaining noon conference!

Ken -- I assure you that, given the choice between taking mountaineering medical advice from Shaq and you, I would choose you every time!

Now, can you teach me to dunk?

I look forward to seeing the information. I often wonder how much of the common information out there varies for each individual. For example, something you frequently read is that one should eat a little bit every hour to keep the fuel supply up. I on the other hand can get by with little food and feel just fine. I often take no food at all unless I know the hike will last more than six or seven hours. Some such as Rick Kent seem to get by with even less without slowing down. How can this be?

Rafael...

Sounds like a good presentation Ken, looking forward to seeing the slides. Were there any main takeaways from the day?

Ellen is a really cool person and very knowledgeable, too. I met her on the Skyline trail in Palm Springs and later, when asked, she gave me some tips to avoid hitting the wall. Her advice worked well for me and I've been hiking more comfortably ever since

Leslie

OK I am baited and hooked. What kind of advice to avoid hitting the wall.Also is what she is presenting a new and novel concept?

Howdy Ken,

Aw shucks. Thanks for your kind words regarding my talk. It was wonderful to meet Ken the mountain doc and then discover we know some of the same folks.

I do most of my posting on the Mt. San Jacinto BB. In fact, I met both Laura and Leslie while hiking on the Skyline trail (I live in Riverside).

As Rafael points out, no one hiking fueling plan works for everyone. I've worked with numerous endurance athletes and helped them customize training and racing fueling plans. I'm happy to try to answer any questions on nutrition.

Background: I completed the Hawaii Ironman triathlon, marathons, and 200 mile bike rides years ago (prior to my back going out). I am a registered dietitian and exercise physiologist. My specialty area is sports nutrition. I completed my first Cactus to Clouds on Cinco de Mayo last year and summited Kilimanjaro in 2004.

Miles of smiles,
Ellen

Nutrition tips to maintain performance while hiking:

Muscle glycogen is the primary fuel for hiking. As your muscles start to run out of muscle glycogen, they use more blood glucose. The longer you hike, the greater the use of blood glucose. Consuming carbohydrate during hiking helps you to maintain your pace and mental concentration.

These are the tips I've provided for hiking Skyline (10 miles, 8,000 ft of elevation gain from the desert museum to the Palm Springs tramway. This hike takes me about 6 hours in the spring. Due to the environment and difficulty of the hike, Skyline places hikers at greater risk for heat stress and subsequent heat illness.

1) Make sure you're adequately rested and nourished going into the hike. I always rest the day before a big hike and also eat more calories than usual (emphasizing carbohydrate). I'm a big fan of Mexican food and usually consume beans, rice, and tortillas the night before. Pasta and stir fry over rice are great, too.

2) Consume a pre-hike meal containing carbohydrate and protein. I generally eat a carton of yogurt (at 5 to 6 AM, it's too early for me to eat more). You could also drink a liquid meal like Boost, Ensure, or Carnation Instant Breakfast or eat oatmeal with fruit.

3) During hiking, I recommend consuming 30-60 grams of carbohydrate per hour. I take in 25 grams or so from carbohydrate gels and get another 14 grams of so from Gatorade each hour. The carbohydrate source can be liquid (sports drink), carbohydrate gel, or solid (sports bar).

4) Start taking in carbohydrate and fluid as early as 30 minutes into the hike to maintain blood glucose and replace fluid losses. I do this by drinking Gatorade Endurance which provides both carbohydrate and water. You can also do this by drinking water and eating high carbohydrate foods. For hiking in hot weather, I recommend added sodium from a higher sodium gel (e.g. Powerbar gel) or sports drink.

5) Carbohydrate raises your blood sugar, protein keeps it from falling. Taking in small amounts of protein can help maintain your blood glucose on long hikes. Some carbohydrate gels also contain protein, most sports bars contain protein.

6) Drink plenty of fluids when consuming solid food, especially sports bars. I recommend higher-carbohydrate sports bars such as PowerBar or Cliff as they're easier to digest compared to those higher in protein and fat.

7) Hiking in the heat increases sweat water and sodium losses. As sweat rates differ markedly between people, you need to determine your own sweat losses. This is harder to determine when you're hiking than if you're running or cycling.

To determine sweat rate, weigh before and after a specified time of exercise (e.g. one hour). Nude weights should be used when possible to avoid corrections for sweat trapped in the clothing. Then, subtract the post-workout weight from the pre-workout weight. Also subtract any urinary fluid losses. Then, add in the amount of fluid consumed during the workout.

An average amount of sodium lost in sweat is 800 mg per quart (2 lb of body weight).

Miles of smiles,
Ellen

Now that we have some real advice, we can address Rafael's question:

Some suspect that Rick Kent is from another planet. I'll just say that he's a few sigmas on the good side of the mean.

I also tend to not take food on a hike of less than 6-7 hours unless it happens to overlap lunch, which I never miss. Unlike Rick, I do make exceptions for hot days and hikes as steep as, say, Iron Mountain.

I recall learning many years ago that an average person has about 2000 Calories worth of glycogen stores. One can bump that up a bit via carbohydrate loading, but that involves depletion, not just eating spaghetti the night before, and is rarely done by the average shmuck. With that much stored energy, one can go for the better part of 20 (flat) miles. That's why one can see world class runners do 20 km, or even longer, races without injesting anything (yes, I know about the BALCO scandal -- I said "injesting" not "injecting").

Walking uses less energy than running, although not tremendously less. It is perfectly reasonable for a fit person to go out for a 20 mile walk without worrying about nutrients. (Note that I am not dealing with water or electrolyte depletion.)

Throwing in hills increases energy expenditure, which is what prompted my comment about Iron Mountain (an extreme example, to be sure).

Ellen has been missing on San Jacinto since Saturday, when she rode the tram up to snowshoe to the peak. Riverside Mountain Rescue and others will resume their search for her in the morning. Here is a link to a thread concerning this on the San J Message Board: http://www.mtsanjacinto.info/viewtopic.php?t=640.

With the current weather conditions being what they are up there, a lot of people are hoping and praying for her safe return.

Dave

BobR reported at 8:30 am today on the Mt. San J. message board that Ellen was found alive and well after spending two nights in the summit hut.

Thank goodness! Let's be careful out there, folks!

Wow! Really glad she is ok. I'll bet it was miserably cold.

Just a question... do cell phones connect at the summit?

Wow. I could not sleep at all last nite, thinking of what Ellen must be going through. I've put my gear away, and am glad that I don't have to use it. The local SAR guy reports that she has a broken ankle. Assuming that she didn't do it right at the hut, she must have shown real grit to get to the shelter and assure her survival with that trauma.

I want to point out that our own local China Lake Mountain Rescue Group was involved in this rescue operation, and Bob R was personally involved. I have to tell you, that if I got stuck somewhere, I would take great comfort in thinking that you were coming, Bob. Thanks to you and your dedicated associates for trying to help my friend.

I'll resist giving Ellen a call today. I'm sure that that it will be spent sleeping (and eating!), but tomorrow, I'll try to get the story.

What a sense of profound relief.

Great news!!!

One can easily make cell phone calls from the summit of San Jacinto. However, receptions is a lot spottier at the hut. I have heard people comment that they could not get a connection there but could on top.

I don't know if Ellen was carryinf a phone, but if I was in the hut with a broken ankle, the summit would seem quite distant.

I climbed to the summit of Mt. San Jancinto in the summer of 2006. I could not get a signal on the summit. I use Verizon.

Rafael...

Doea anyone have the link to the San J message board?

try this San Jacinto message board

The thread following Ellen's situation is in Dave G's post above.