Mt. Whitney Portal Store & Hostel Forums General Mt. Whitney Portal Store Message Board sleeping on the trail

Hi everyone.......it seems like it is difficult getting a good sleep on while on the trail. Maybe I am just excited....maybe the elevation is keeping me awake....maybe it is the confinement of a sleeping bag.....maybe it is the lack of a good thick pad or pillow.

Any thoughts about getting a good sleep camped out at 10000 - 12000 feet. It obviously makes the next day more difficult if you woke up 10 times during the night.

Thanks

I took one melatonin sublingual pill and a tryptophan tablet. Both stimulate seratonin for a natural non drug induced sleep at 10,000 ft and slept like a baby.

I always count the first night out on a trip as a bad sleep night.

I take a couple of Benadryl tablets, and that seems to work for me. By the second night, I'm tired and worn out, so I sleep pretty well.

Edit: By the way, Benadryl is also known as dyphenhydramine.

There is a product made by Tylenol that is called "Simply Sleep". It's a non-prescription sleep aid containing 25 mg of Diphenhydramine HCI that has worked well for me the night before a big hike. Not too strong, and no hangover........nothing like a good night of sleep to get you going!

hey kent...myself at the portal,or ice berg lake if I take Flurazepam 15mg early enough I can get a good night sleep I might wake up a few times but go right back to sleep for me its a good 6 to 7 hr sleep..If you take it to late and get up early than you might have a hangover...

If I go to sleep with out taking anything and wake up in the middle of the night wide awake than I take Ambien 10mg (shorter acting) whole or half a pill...

But this is what works for me for the last 5 years on the mountain and at home, it runs in the family on my moms side..

also kent are you going to Whitney around christmas vacation

take care hope to meet you on the tail some day, for me next time on mountain hopeing for new years weeked....mark

For me, it seems just to be the adjustment to different sleeping accommodations. I run into the same problem whether on a weekend campout, a backpacking trip or just a business trip. The first night out, I never sleep well. Second night, no problem. I do take a 3mg Melatonin, which helps a little but it's really just adjusting to a different locale/bed/lack thereof that works for me...

Shot of brandy, like the old school mountaineers...

Personally I hate the drug induced sleep. i feel like crap for several days. Even the Tylenol PM stuff makes me feel like crap so I would rather lose sleep than feel like that. Haven't tried ambien personally but most other sleep meds are lousy IMO. L-Tryptophan and Melatonin work well.

Benadryl, which has Diphenhydramine hydrocholoride, is the same medicine found in many of the over the counter sleeping pills. For example it can be found in Tylenol pm, Sominex, Nytol. It is a good antihistamine, but has some sedative side effects.

Many years ago I read it is not a great idea to take Benadryl the first night at higher elevations. Supposedly it prevents or slows down some of the altitude adjustment you get while sleeping. So the thinking is you might sleep better, at the expense on more altitude problems the next day.

I don't think the sleeping issue is easy to solve. Even car camping with comfortable padding, I find it much harder to sleep well. The same is often true on the road at a hotel. As much as anything, it might just be the anticipation issue, combined with the comfort problems. I always wake up with a sore back when backpacking.

The 2nd or 3rd night I always sleep better, probably because I am so much more tired. Limit your caffine intake late in the day. Consider some warm milk.

One thing not mentioned. You change your sleep times. You drive to the portal all excited, going to sleep at 8:00pm and planning to get up at 3:00 am. No wonder the first 2-3 hours you have a hard time getting to sleep.

My biggest problem sleeping on my trips was the lack of a pillow.

So now I stuff all my extra cloths and things into the sleeping bag stuff bag to make a pillow. Getting my head a few inches off the ground aligns my back so that I don't wake up with a killer backache.

Possible sleep hindrances (singly, or in combination):

• Jet lag (if applicable)
• Hike/adventure anticipation!
• Uncomfortable sleeping conditions (insufficient pillow/padding on ground or in car, cramped quarters in car, etc.)
• Changed sleeping hours from normal
• Altitude
• Wind (if present)
• Cold (if present)
• Other inclement weather (if present)
• Bear and critter potential encounter awareness
• Other hikers/BPers in area (noise)
• Tent-mate noise/snoring (if present)
• Nuisance insects (if present)

CaT

Good grief! I think I'll stay at home next time.

I guess it does sound a little like one of those drug commercials on TV where they list all the possible side effects of the drug, regardless of how remote...

Just one item from that list is generally an issue for me. For now, my fondness runs toward day hikes, primarily because the hard ground always wins the "back vs. hard ground" contest due to the pretend sleeping pad I use. I have what is billed as Thermarest's "best", and my not-overweight body still easily connects with the ground under the pad, making for a miserable sleep and a stiff/sore wake-up.

CaT

Have you tried using two pads? Your Thermarest plus a closed foam? The closed foam can be 3/4 length, and is almost a necessity on snow and ice, but it adds a level of comfort. Not quite like your own bed, but much better than a single pad of either type.

Think air, think Big Agnes Insulated Air Core. It ain't a Serta Perfect Sleeper but it beats a Therm-a-Rest...IMHO.

I'm a side sleeper in it has improved my sleep as long as I inflate it properly.

"The harder the toil, the sweeter the slumber" worked great for me over the summer.

At home I sleep on my side and seldom move.Partly because my wife hogs the bed and partly because that is how I sleep in my bag. In fact when I can't sleep I close my eyes and think of my favorite hike (usually the last one I went on) and sleep comes quickly. I try not to alter my sleep whether I am at home or away and I sleep just fine.

Way back when I was in high school, my seasonal allergies would just kill me, and before the non-sedating antihistamines were developed, the only option was drugs like Benadryl. I would feel terrible both after taking it and the next day. It was during a sleep class I took as an undergrad that I learned there's a physiologic reason that antihistamines make you feel exhausted the next day, even after a long sleep. It interferes with your REM sleep cycles. A "normal" night of sleep usually runs in a series of successively deeper stages, from stage 1 non-REM to stage 4 nREM. About 90 minutes into a cycle, a REM phase commences. This is your deepest level of sleep, where your dreams will be the most vivid. On Benadryl, the REM sleep cycles are greatly diminished. It's not a satisfying or quality sleep. Your central nervous system will compensate, if it can the next night, with a REM-rebound (a larger percentage of REM sleep, and faster REM-onset).

I would advise a benzodiazepine (Valium was the prototype, Restoril and Ativan are the more common) or an ambien as a short-term solution (i.e. the first night only.)

I find when I sleep on the trail people tend to keep walking on my sleeping bag, keeping me up. If I sleep OFF to the side of the trail I sleep better.

Sorry. Seriously, I have the same problem. The first night or two it's no sleep. I think it's mostly the excitement of hitting the trail in the morning. Part of it may be altitude if I haven't been up there in a while. Another reason is the fact that the ground is harder today than it was when I was younger - I think due to the increased gravitational force from the continued spin of the earth.

It seems like your problem isn't getting to sleep, you were able to do it 10 times during the night. The problem may be that you are a light sleeper and you are being awakened by minor noises around you, like from others at your campsite rustling around during the night. Try ear plugs.